Lapsed Gamer Radio: Episode 106 – Interview with Peter Chapman of Oscar Mike Media [2018]

Date: 14/05/2018

Interviewers: Stuart & Ali

Interviewee: Peter Chapman

Source: https://lapsedgamerradio.podbean.com/e/lgr-episode-106-interview-with-peter-chapman-of-oscar-mike-media/


Q: Hello and welcome to another episode of Lapsed Gamer Radio. I’m your host, Ali, joining me tonight is my co-host, Ali. On tonight’s episode we have an interviewee who is a friend of mine: it is Pete Chapman. Tell us a little bit about yourself and what you currently do within the games industry.

Peter Chapman: So I guess the most notable thing I do at the moment is, I work for a company called Oddworld Inhabitants, that many of your listeners have probably heard of. So they had games out the end of the 90s and since then they’ve released five games now. And we’re working on the sixth, which is due at some undefined point in the future. And that’s the interesting thing about me, I don’t think anything else is particularly worth noting. I mean I run a company that, marketing consultancy and we do all sorts of different things but primarily Oddworld at the moment.

Q: The company of you referring to there is Oscar Mike Media Limited? It’s really hard to find any specific information about Oscar Mike Media on the internet. I find a company’s house listing, I find a website with a logo. I’d seen that there is some sort of partnership or something there to do with TheSixthAxis.com as well. What is your company does?

Peter Chapman: So yeah we haven’t, we’ve never needed to advertise, which is a good thing. The company was founded Oscar Mike Media was founded 2010, I think. Really to deal with advertising and potential content licensing [2:08] for TheSixthAxis.com, which is a website that I only managed for several years. So we needed a kind of a legal entity to cope with that stuff as it grew and became a bigger thing to deal with. So that’s why the company was founded. And then about three years ago it became, it sort of evolved into giving us this legal entity within the UK to build business-to-business and contract work out to Oddworld at the time. So yeah we’ve known it was really set up as a reaction to needing a company so that we could invoice other companies, and then it has evolved from then into being this consultancy company. So that’s also where the association with TheSixthAxis comes from. That was kind of where I started working in the games industry and initially voluntarily and then becoming more and more involved with it; into managing other people and then managing the whole thing.

Q: With TheSixthAxis.com you’d said you owned it. Was that you that actually set it up?

Peter Chapman: So it was set up by a friend of mine who is also the reason why I now work for Oddworld. We’re still, we still work together. So set up by him and one of his other friends who, shortly after I started working with them, they kind of decided that it wasn’t something that they could take the responsibility of. They both had full-time jobs, my colleague that I work with still. He had a family, a young family sort of, it was just under half his family, so they wanted somebody that would be more involved with like the day-to-day running all that, the management of it. And also take the responsibility of the legal implications that were there, in the ethical implications were there. So that was really what I did, so it wasn’t set up by me, I think I got involved maybe within six months of it starting at the time. I’ve been made redundant from my work and wasn’t in any real rush to run back into the workplace; is always something that I’ve struggled with with. And working for bosses has never been a strong point of mine [laughs]. So at the time I was kind of unemployed and not mad keen on getting into the grind of looking for a job. So I was spending my time sort of doing what I enjoy doing, which was: playing video games, writing about video games and discussing games with other people. That evolved into taking up way too much time in the comments of TheSixthAxis [laughs]; talking to other users and from that, that kind of evolved into, well, you have write in a thousand words a day anyway. So how about you just come and do that in an official capacity [4:41]? And then from, like I say, it evolved more into a management, and eventually I ended up buying the site from my friend. For a ridiculously low sum of money. And taken over full-time and then he left and I continued to manage it and now I’ve, technically I still own the domain but it’s completely run by other people now. And I have absolutely nothing to do with it, and it’s on the one hand a massive relief and obviously something I can’t really do: is conflicts of interest out with my current work. So I can’t really do anything with them at the moment, so it’s a bit of a relief to have that off my plate. On the other hand, I kind of really miss critiquing games and being involved in the day-to-day sort of keep it up to date with the news and the review cycles.

Q: TheSixthAxis, are they actually then a customer of Oscar Mike Media?

Peter Chapman: Yeah, you could say that. You’d say they were a customer but they don’t actually pay us anything. So we basically, I retain the domain more out of convenience than anything else. It’s just hassle to get that signed over. I’m still very friendly with the guys that run the site. So yeah, and we would provide basics like technology services for them. So web design stuff up to this point well up until maybe a year ago we were still doing that kind of thing for them. Now started looking to do it for themselves and maybe keep it a little bit more current than we have the time to provide them.

Q: The next question is: how does a company from Northern Ireland getting contact with Oddworld Inhabitants who are all asleep based in California in America? How did that come about?

Peter Chapman: So one of the most important things that I tell anybody that’s ever getting involved with video games and wants to work in the industry is to be nice to everyone and maintain those relationships, and just stay friendly with everyone. So, the guy that asked me to help out at TheSixthAxis when he left; he left to go and work as a web developer for a company called Just Add Water [6:45]. We kind of knew a little bit from our time at TheSixthAxis anyway, they’d made a game on Vita or maybe PSP. I can’t remember how far back it went called Gravity Crash. It was like a twin stick shooter, like almost like a lambda thing. So we kind of knew them, and then they made the HD remakes ofMunch’s Oddysee and Stranger’s Wrath. So we kind of had a little bit of relationship with him anyway, but he obviously knew the guy that ran, called Stewart Gilray. I think he knew quite well. So he got a job with them anyways, a web developer and he worked with them for, gonna say maybe just over a year while they were working on Oddworld: New ‘n’ Tasty!. So they were like a I say, they’d make the HD remakes of Munch and Stranger for Oddworld. I think that was basically a case of the company get in contact with Lorne Lanning and hassling him until he said “well, yeah, okay, we’ll let you do them”. So they did them to some decent perception and then they got the contract to work on New ‘n’ Tasty. They worked on that for however long that took them. It seemed to be many years, but when that came out then, obviously they had no need for web developer anymore and my friend’s contract was coming to a close, but he had developed this relationship with Lorne Lanning and the guys at Oddworld. And they said obviously it sort of towards the end of the game’s development, everybody gets involved in doing everything and he’d been so pushed into the marketing stuff. And he’d done a lot of that so when his contract was up, with joy they said, Oddworld said, “well, come and work for us directly”. And he said “absolutely, yes, that’d be fantastic but there’s way too much work in that for one person, so I kind of need some assistance and another guy” [laughs]. Phoned me up one day and says ” do you fancy, come on and work for Oddworld”. And I said “hmm let me think about that for about 30 seconds”. And then jump at the chance. So I had a quick, like, I wouldn’t even call it an “interview”. I had a quick, like just an informal chat with Lorne, discussing what I can do, what my abilities are and what they need. And from that he asked me to join the team and that was really, I think I was technically employed part-time for the first year. I was only meant to be on a contract for him, say 20 hours a week, I think. On that ended up very quickly, basically just working full-time on it. And then at the end of the first year, Lorne said “okay, we see what you do, maybe we’ll start paying you properly for it now” [laughs]. And they increased that contract so we’re both on full-time now, so Oscar Mike Media is really just the two of us, and we are full-time on Oddworld.

Q: So to an extent then, while you’re employed by, you’re almost like a contracted company?

Peter Chapman: We’re, absolutely, yeah, we are completely contractors.

Q: It was interesting what you said about being humble if you like and being very pleasant within the industry, because I guess that’s how we’ve all met each other. I know it was Eurogamer; we’re talking now four, maybe five years ago we first met?

Peter Chapman: Maybe three years ago.


[9:54 – 11:32]


Q: With the sort of marketing side of it then, there is so many different strategies and things for marketing, these days. How important do you think the role of the YouTubers and influencers has become, and with respect to marketing now?

Peter Chapman: I would suggest: probably the most important. We still, obviously, have relationships with traditional media. This is maybe an indication of how far along the YouTubers or the influencers—I really hate that term—but that’s kind of what the industry has decided to go with. When I say “traditional media”, I’m lumping in websites with that. You know, while we do have relationships with like newspapers and magazines, and it’s always nice to be featured in any of those. And obviously it’s great to on IGN or GameSpot, or like any of the big websites. It’s fantastic. On the smaller websites sometimes, I think they do commit more interesting work so it’s nice to see how those different people cover you. But I think in terms of, like a maximum impact, specifically around the launch period and in the build-up to a launch period, I think that streamers and YouTubers are probably the most piece of the puzzle there. I think that’s for companies of all sizes. You know, you see small developers, small publishers like Mike Rose’s team: they did absolutely outstanding work with Discord around their game descenders. You see that it’s sort of trying to duplicate that with subsequent games that he’s announcing. But really imaginative like community-led things that they’re doing, as a small developer. And also the big developers like EA and Activision, now sort of starting to realize that maybe that’s something they should be doing as well and rather than just getting into “well, we’ll pay x thousands of dollars to this massive YouTuber for him to make a video for us”, they’re trying to engage on a more gassroots community level. And I think that for all angles of the video game industry if you’re in publishing which even, you know, I include developers and self-publishing in that. If you’re publishing a game, you need to be talking to people who are going to play that game and people who are going to influence others to play that game. And most of that now is happening on YouTube and Twitch.

Q: Do you find that the smaller channels and influencers, do you find that they offer more passion than the big IGNs, GameSpots and things like that, or does it not really make much difference? Not to tarnish the bigger people with a brush, but do you find that sometimes they’ll just do it because they’ve got an obligation to do it? Where if you went to a smaller company or a smaller YouTuber or whatever podcaster that there put a bit more passion into it, a bit more effort into it because they’re grateful for you approaching them?

Peter Chapman: Yeah, I’m not sure if “passion” is the right word, I think. Because I think that, I certainly hope that anybody that does that job for one of the big sites like IGN for example; I would hope that they still have a passion for it—I would hope that they would still put that passion into their work, regardless of what it was. I think with smaller sites maybe there’s an element of, they have maybe a little bit more time to dedicate [15:00], maybe a little bit more of a particular interest in your thing. Also, I know myself we were; TheSixthAxis was not a big site particularly, certainly at the beginning. So I know myself when you’re dealing with a developer or publisher and they show an interest in you and what you’re doing. It kind of makes you want to spend as much, at least dedicate enough time to their product, so you can give it a fair crack of the whip, where potentially journalists, larger sites, you know they may be love your game and what they’ve seen, they think it’s fantastic and they really want to get the best coverage out of it but they’ve only got three hours on a Wednesday afternoon to do something with it. And then they have to move on to the next. Whereas I think smaller specialists media or independent media, I think maybe can dedicate a little bit more of their time because they’re deciding what they want to dedicate their time to. Where is the bigger outlets I think maybe they’ve got a little bit more pressure to split their time up. I certainly think that smaller places can definitely be more interesting in the way they cover things, like there’s a number of smaller sites. And one specifically is a site called “Finger Guns”, that I don’t think, they don’t have a particularly large audience but they’ve been doing really like interesting games coverage and really like kind of informal video games coverage that I really enjoy the style of. So I tend to like a lot of what they do. A lot more than sort of the more sterile businesslike pieces you would get on larger game sites.

Q: Is there a risk with streaming YouTube that, for the amount of keys and things that get sent out, only a small percentage of people will actually cover the game?

Peter Chapman: There is, but you get that risk no matter where you are, I think. No matter what you’re trying to do, you get that kind of risk. Certainly on Steam, codes are free, we don’t, you know, pay for that. Steam generates them and we can basically generate as many as we want, and if there’s a chance of coverage, you know you’re sending them to people who run websites. They’re not going to end up on the gray market being sold by the shadier websites. So it’s almost like it’s worth sending keys to people in the hope that they’ll cover your game. Well, it’s almost certainly not lost revenue, and you get the chance to, now the sensible thing to do is try and have those relationships in place before it comes to that time. So like even now, we’re still some distance from Soulstorm‘s release and we’re talking to influencers and we’re trying to develop those relationships because we know that they’re gonna be important to us in the future, as a small company that doesn’t have money to spend on ad budget. We are trying to identify the people that are passionate about what we do, that we know will be enthusiastic about our game when they get to play it. We don’t know but we expect we’ll be enthusiastic if we do our job right. So when it comes time to as we’re approaching preview cycles and review cycles, we have those relationships there to use. And I think that’s something that everybody in the industry’s doing.

Q: From a marketing point of view, is it cheaper and more effective to give out free keys than it is to buy like pay for ads and things like that to publicize your game? And it’s probably a bit of a 50/50 but…

Peter Chapman: I think that those two things are maybe separate things. I would say, if you’re advertising, you’re probably advertising to people who aren’t watching those streamers and YouTubers and stuff, to a degree. And obviously there’s some crossover there, so adverts are basically about like catching people who don’t know that you’ve got a product out there, and saying “look, here’s my product, doesn’t it look interesting?”. Whereas the relationships you develop with press or with streamers and influencers is more like people know your products, come in, and maybe they’ll seek it out. So they just want more information before it’s available. And the other part of that is that you identify with certain streamers of certain influences, you will kind of get a feel for what they do and what they enjoy doing and what sort of games they enjoy playing. So then you know what their audience likes to see and if that marries up with what you’re trying to do. Then it’s often worth working with them. I know some of the really big influences charge for coverage, as you’d expect when you you’ve got a big audience like that, you know. They’re in business too. And there’s a lot of work in running those channels. So I don’t really blame them for that [19:58]. But like I say we’re a small company, we don’t really have; our budgets are better spent elsewhere, let’s say. So we try and find people we know like us, and that we like them and work with those people. And so far it’s worked out pretty well for us. Soulstorm has to be a bigger product, so we’re looking at expanding on that idea and finding bigger, bigger channels to work with maybe, but some of the people who covered New ‘n’ Tasty when it came out, they’ve been playing games and putting videos on YouTube, and their channels are growing too. So we like to see, you know, we’re a small company but we like to see the smaller people that we’ve worked with before. We like to see them grow too and they sort of growing with us as we develop this bigger game.

Q: It’s been said that there’s no such thing as bad publicity. How does that sort of go against or go with the slightly more controversial sides of streamers and YouTubers?

Peter Chapman: I would tend to disagree with that sentiment. I think it’s probably unprofessional of me to name names [laughs]. But I think that, for example, having your game be championed by somebody who has shown themselves to be, without question, like a terrible racist or horrible misogynist or homophobe or whatever they may be. You know somebody’s saying here “this game’s fantastic, everyone should play this game and also I really don’t like Jewish people”, for example. You know, as a viewer I would watch that I think “oh, he’s found the game, oh my god he’s that kind of person, well maybe I don’t have the same tastes as him”.

Q: Is that a case of you kind of follow or get to know your influences beforehand, just so you can see what other media they’ve put out, and different thing, just to kind of circumvent that if someone clicks on other videos they’re not suddenly going to get, you know, pornographic video or something crazy?

Peter Chapman: I think that’s certainly part of it. That’s part of developing a relationship, is that we tend to try and know the people that we’re working with a little better than we would do if it was going through like a publicist that then talks to an agent; you know we’d like to talk directly to the people that we’re working with. I mean, people make mistakes and things happen sometimes, you know, the heat of the moment people can say things that perhaps that they wouldn’t usually say. It’s all in how they deal with that, I think. Obviously, we don’t know exactly all the political opinions of the people that we work with, and maybe they have political opinions that wouldn’t match up with mine. I’m quite politically outspoken, anybody that follows me on Twitter is probably sick of hearing me. And I’m quite forthright about that, and that’s fine. I don’t mind seeing that from anybody else. And having that kind of disagreement with people, if so I mean there’s people within the same team that I would have political disagreements with. It’s in about how you deal with that, and how you do make mistakes, how you cope with that. So yeah, I think that part of it is certainly trying to get to know people on a more personal level, so that we can be fairly confident that they’re not gonna say anything, like terrible. But then, another part of it is that everybody makes mistakes and, you know, if somebody is a nice genuine person, then when they make a mistake they’re gonna hold their hands up and say “yeah, that was bad”.

Q: Do you have a, I don’t know, like a blacklist up on the wall of people that you don’t, or try to avoid interacting with?

Peter Chapman: Me personally? Not really [laughs]. I’m sure there are, for some of the people on the team, that have been on the team for a lot longer than I have, I’m sure there are certain outlets, certain personalities that they just maybe haven’t gotten along with. But there’s no blacklist that says “right, we are not working with these people”. I mean, I have my own personal tastes for the people that I’ve enjoyed coverage from, on other games. So there are people that I’m very keen to work with and often as I can because I really like their output and want to be associated with those people. Both going the other way and not really, I mean it goes back to what we said the very start, people tend to know that the way to get to ahead in this business is to be nice to people [24:56]. Nobody’s gonna be unreasonably nasty about anything that we would have to start thinking about blacklists [laughs].

Q: Big question now: can you actually tell us anything about Soulstorm?

Peter Chapman: What do you want to know?

Q: Release date.

Peter Chapman: Also, there’s a little bit of, this is a little bit of showmanship from Stuart because I’ve actually showing him things from Soulstorm [Laughs].

Ali: And you’ve not shared it with me, Stu?

Stuart: Oh no, I don’t think I have. In our previous meetings, I think I saw something running on a mobile phone, but…

Peter Chapman: Oh yeah, we showed you New ‘n’ Tasty well before that came out.

Q: Are we looking 2018?

Peter Chapman: Honestly, I don’t know, and there is still a lot of development to go. There is a lot of hard work being done on that. I know that back when we announced it, was kind of suggested; I’m not sure if we ever said explicitly but it’s kind of suggested that maybe would release towards the end of 2017. And we’ve obviously blown past that. 2018, I think, maybe.

Q: Is it something that we might first see at E3?

Peter Chapman: I really don’t know. We have stuff, I mean we have the playable levels, and we have videos that we’re working on; trailers and that’s; I mean there are assets there, but we are also, I mean like I’ve suggested a couple of times, Soulstorm has to be a much bigger game at retail than New ‘n’ Tasty was. And that’s down to how much has been spent on it and how much work is going into it. I mean, I know that fans don’t necessarily like what they think of as a delay, and I totally get that. I’m right there with you, but the kind of the scope of this project has, I would say, significantly grown since we announced it. And that’s down to the ambition behind the creative team. So I don’t want to say, and certainly we’re not ready to officially say “yes we’ll be out in this month of this year”. For two reasons, and one of them being: I just don’t know, I just don’t know how much more development work is going to be added to the schedules of those guys. Those poor developers that are doing such great work. Nobody’s seeing it yet so they’re doing this fantastic work and it’s all sort of in the dark. But also, I don’t want to, I don’t want to say anything about release dates that might get in the way of potential deals that we have to do with publishers or store managers or, you know, we will listen to all the advice we get from everybody that gives advice on those things. And we’ll decide our best release date from then, based on when we think we’ll be finished.

Q: I guess there’s some of it, the release date, there’s some of that depend on, obviously, of what else is going to be released at a similar time. There’s not much of an empty window these days of when to release a game, unfortunately.

Peter Chapman: There’s certainly not [28:24]. I mean that part of what I do is strategizing for that kind of stuff so. Even things that maybe it wouldn’t be an immediate concern, obviously you don’t release in the same day as the new Call of Duty. And this year, even Call of Duty‘s move another way from Read Dead Redemption, whatever the Red Dead game is called this year. So you know those are obvious like games things that every gamer knows that you don’t want to be falling on the same way. But then you also have to think, like you don’t do big milestones on the Easter weekend because Europe’s all off work at Easter so nobody really pays much attention to that; releasing a game in the second week of July this year would be a terrible idea because the bulk of finals are on… So the way you think of it, really is that you’re not just competing for what games people are going to buy, you’re competing for their screen time. So I might even suggest that it might not be a great idea to release a new game the week that Game of Thrones starts back on TV. You try and look at all those things and figure out, well, people are going to have some screen time here or if some big new free-to-play games coming out that’s expected to do really well. You have to give it a few weeks to let its audience playing enough of it and get back to looking at other games.

Q: So with the new game, is it gonna be a similar kind of play style to the other Abe‘s games?

Peter Chapman: So we’ve shown a couple of bits and pieces of it, that do show it as a side on 2D platformer style thing from the screenshots. I think, again, the scope of that is much bigger than it was when set out, so I think there’s a lot more immersion to it than there was to New ‘n’ Tasty. So while it is still that side on platforming game, there’s a lot more sort of in and out with the camera [30:34] and a lot more depth to the world, than there was with New ‘n’ Tasty. I think New ‘n’ Tasty‘s contribution to Soulstorm as a project is that it’s paying for it. So I think what Lorne would say is, people asked him similar questions, and he says that back in 2007, I think, they got, when they had all the rights back for their own IP, but they were, as a team I guess, Lorne and Sherry McKenna, they were working on different things. So they just weren’t interested in getting back into games at that point and I think that it was suggested to them that there was potential for the catalog games: Abe’s Oddysee, Abe’s Exoddus, Munch’s Oddysee and Stranger’s Wrath. They put those on Steam, as a test. People keep asking for this, so let’s see how it goes and they put them on Steam and were blown away by the response and how well those games sold, 10 years, 15 years after they were made. 20 years after Abe’s Oddysee was made. People were buying it and loving it. And not just the fact that they were selling, but the user reviews coming in and was so strong and so great. I think that’s really what made them think “well, okay, actually there is still a market here that loves that stuff and maybe we can go back to making that for them”, and so I think that gave way then to the HD remasters for PlayStation platforms and some of that’s fed back onto the PC as well. Stranger’s Wrath on mobile is HD version and kind of all that helped the company build strength and build capital to invest in developing New ‘n’ Tasty which was the ground-up remake of Abe’s Oddysee. But again, New ‘n’ Tasty was kind of, I wouldn’t call it a half step but it was maybe like 0.9 of a step to a brand new game, because it was a complete ground up remake. All the assets are different and obviously it’s HD and it’s stunning visuals and all. But it still took its design and inspiration from Abe’s Oddysee. So when that game was made and how well that game did, and I think that there was interviews with Lorne back a the time when he said “well, if we sell x amount copies of New ‘n’ Tasty, then we’ll have the capital to be able to make our next game”. And obviously, they did that, so I think New ‘n’ Tasty brought in enough revenue back into the company and strenghtened the company and strenghtened the brand and sort of gave us a prominence amongst a modern audience that maybe we haven’t quite had up to that point. And that enables us to go forward and make Soulstorm which is totally brand-new, there’s nothing in that really owes anything to any of the previous games [33:46].

Q: I think of New ‘n’ Tasty because it was, as most of us would know is Abe’s Oddysee, and then obviously it was New ‘n’ Tasty it’s been like I say, built from the ground-up. But it gave those people that had never played Abe’s Oddysee, or maybe, dare I say, too young to play it [laughs]? It pains me to say that. To find out what it’s all about, and yeah is really, really good remaster, remake.

Peter Chapman: We tried to call it a remake because there’s a lot of confusion the way it was announced. And the way people spoke about it in the sort of the early stages were just that it was Abe HD, it was a remake of Abe’s Oddysee or a remaster of Abe’s Oddysee.

Q: Plus, there was new bits in it, there was some extra, not DLC but…

Peter Chapman: Yeah, there was a few areas that were slightly changed and there was the Alf’s Escape DLC: that was a brand new, well it was a brand new level, it was like maybe half an hour, 45 minutes long. And so it’s quite substantial. And that was all brand new.

Q: At this stage in the interviews, and we always sort of, you know, throw it over to you or our guest, to plug, publicize, give shout outs to whoever or whatever they want to. So go ahead and do what you need to do.

Peter Chapman: I don’t really have, because we don’t have a game coming to market whithin the next few months. So I don’t really have anything that I particularly want to pimp at this stage. Other than to say that everyone should, I guess, follow us on Twitter and Facebook and all that.

Q: Where can we get you on Facebook and Twitter?

Peter Chapman: So Facebook we are https://www.facebook.com/OfficialOddworld/ and then Twitter, and Instagram, we are at Oddworld Inc. And then we have a Discord channel as well, so if you go to Oddworld.com there’s like a big slide at the front that will give you access to our Discord.

Q: What’s on your Discord and what little snippets or things or is it just a general chat with fans and things or how much as the development team involved…

Peter Chapman: All of the people that work in social marketing, so myself, my colleague Alex and a woman that we work with on social media stuff, Bernice. We’re all there and we’re pretty active there. And some of the guys from Fat Kraken, who are one of the developers, they’re based in, I think they’re in Leeds or around Leeds. Some of them drop in from time to time. So it is mostly just like general chat but people will ask us questions about lore or questions about the development process as it pertained to particular facts that they want to know. The Oddworld community is super knowledgeable. Not even joking, there have been times when I’ve contacted members of the Oddworld community and said “do you remember this, what’s like the story behind that?” and they’ll fill me in on some of the facts and like set me straight for the way I’m thinking of things. But there is broader stuff there too and there is, I mean these channels there for just general entertainment. And then there was, most recently one of the most active channels, was associated with the kickstarter campaign that guys Indie by Design run. So they’ve run a campaign to make a book about Abe and it’s called Abe’s origins. So it was all about Abe and where he came from as a character and how his character grew and it’s gonna be full of new art from the found four boxes [37:30] of art under Lorne’s house that nobody had looked through for like 20 years. Lorne had pulled out from under his house; he was like “maybe I should have a look at this” and we were like “uh huh maybe you should send us that” [laughs]. So we’re posting an image a day onto our Instagram at the moment; but also a lot of it will end up in this book and it’s all rare: some of it are unseen, some hasn’t been seen publicly at all. So that will go into the book, and we did a game collection with them in collaboration with Limited Run Games as well. So that was all quite excited and it gave the fans a place where they could sort of live chat to us and the guys from Indie by Design that are making the book.

Q: Has that Kickstarter campaign finished?

Peter Chapman: It has just finished, and finished on Friday of last week. We set a target at the start of that of 45,000 Pounds and at the end of it, we hit a hundred and fifty four thousand and something. So something like three hundred and thirty percent of our target. So yeah, everyone was really pleased with the way that went. And I think kind of reflects that there is a thirst for that kind of, at least for the nostalgic Oddworld stuff that people link to the games they enjoyed when they were young.